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    Question from a noob #582 09/17/07 06:34 AM
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    northBeachFish Offline OP
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    First off, hello to the forum. This seems like a great site.

    I've got a couple questions and instead of making multiple threads I thought I'd put them all in one.

    First off allow me to introduce myself. I'm Joe and I have some fishing background. It's odd but applicable. I grew up in north Florida -- Gainesville to be precise -- and behind our home we had a creek that me and brother waded in with nets to catch fish and crawfish, which we brought home and placed in our aquariums. We both loved fish and one summer when we were 10 and 11, we took a fish class offered by the Florida State Museum on the UoF campus. It wasn't a fishing class, it was a study of fish and their habits. Basically, we tromped around with a grad student and netted fish and talked about fish and identified different species from the pounds and creeks on campus.

    Flash forward about 30 years. Me and my wife moved from Seattle to Miami Beach. We've been here three years. We're not thrilled with the place. In fact, we were considering packing up and leaving when we discovered snorkeling. We snorkeled in clear water on the shoreline in a giant school of bait fish and loved it. On the edges were barracuda and some good sized snook. Anyway, the snorkeling lead to lobstering, which lead to kayaks, which has now lead to fishing from kayaks.

    Saturday was our first fishing trip. All new gear. We put in on Oleta River, a state park and creek that runs parallel to the ICW for a couple miles. As we were putting in, we noticed a school of what I think were mullet tearing around the area in fear for their lives. We rigged up popping corks and dangled live shrimp about 15-20 inches below. Five minutes in I landed a permit. True beginners luck. It was a keeper but I put it back because, one, I didn't know the regs (I was expecting trout) and two I had no idea how to clean the beast. We landed several barracuda and lost quite a bit of tackle to them during the day.

    Anyway, my questions are these:

    1) How do I keep from losing so much tackle when fishing in these types of areas?

    2) The snook I mentioned earlier, what's a good way to fish for them and can they be enticed when there's so much bait in the water and they appear to be content to sit on the bottom right next to it?

    Thanks in advance.


    First day fishing in Miami, five minutes after tossing a line in, bingo! Fourteen-inch permit. True beginner's luck.
    Re: Question from a noob [Re: northBeachFish] #583 09/17/07 05:17 PM
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    Capt. Jesse Karen Offline
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    see your email bro!


    Capt. Jesse Karen
    Fishing the 10,000 Islands in Naples, Marco Island and Everglades City!
    Families or professionals, I'll put you on the fish!

    http://www.madsnookin.com

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: Capt. Jesse Karen] #585 09/18/07 07:48 AM
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    Here's my 2 cents ... always leave the permit in the water. As for snook, I mostly catch and release, but have been guilty of keeping a few, which make for good table fare. If you are looking for some good eating fish, load up on mangroves (snapper). They are very tasty. Not sure if they are in your area, but hogfish are delicious. You should also be able to find grouper for the dinner menu.

    Losing tackle is a part if life when you are live bait fishing. I do a fair amount of kayak fishing for reds and specs and rarely lose tackle fishing tails (sand eels on a jighead), topwaters, spoons, spinnerbaits and a variety of other artificial baits.

    Kayak fishing allows you to get places a boat can't go. Take advantage of this ability and you will find fish many folks aren't accessing. I have an '07 Skeeter 22 Bay, which is a very nice inshore boat, but there are times when I opt for my Malibu eXtreme kayak over the boat.

    Be sure and post some photos for us. Off the topic ... my wife and I are photographers and use Cannon digital SLRs. Olympus, however, in my opinion is leading the way for point-and-shoot water-proof and -resistant cameras. Here's a new one I found while searching a link for you - http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/product.asp?product=1314. We're about to buy one for kayak and boat trips. They range from around $200-$400. If you are looking for an on-the-water camera, or even for shallow diving and snorkeling, the Olympus looks like a great choice.

    You may find that photography becomes as much fun as fishing and snorkeling while you are on the water - it has for us!

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: FFF Staff] #586 09/18/07 08:29 AM
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    northBeachFish Offline OP
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    Capt. Jesse, I checked and did not receive an e-mail from you. Can you post your response here?

    JP, crazy, but I'm also a photographer. Me and my wife met in the Army. We were both journalists. Fact, I was the military photojournalist of the year twice. I worked as an editor for daily newspapers and monthly magazines when I got out. Anyway, I have a Olympus point and shoot digital that I got largely based on the performance of their film version and I can't stand it. It has no view finder, just a lcd screen that is useless in the bright sun. I believe the Stylus 790 SW is the same.

    I just took a look at the Malibu mini-x online. We went with the Wilderness Systems Riper due mostly on space considerations -- it's 8 feet -- and its price, only $320. But, you get soaked paddling it. Not a big deal most of the time in South Florida, but it will become an issue later on. The Mini-x would be better since it would keep us dry to a degree, but we've tapped out the recreational budget for at least a year... big purchases anyway.

    A question for you. Why throw the permit back? I thought they were good table fish? And how about the snook hanging around the school of bait fish? Are they interested in feeding? From looking at them under water, they don't seem interested, but we'll find out Friday night when we go down there with DOA shrimp.



    First day fishing in Miami, five minutes after tossing a line in, bingo! Fourteen-inch permit. True beginner's luck.
    Re: Question from a noob [Re: northBeachFish] #587 09/18/07 10:26 AM
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    Permits are in the jack family. They are great sporting fish, but are not to my taste. Most people consider jacks a little greasy for table fare. Amberjacks are good eating, but you usually won't find one inshore.

    Bonefish and tarpon fall in the same category - lots of fun to catch and some of the most sought after gamefish in the world, but you will rarely find someone eating them.

    As you get back in to fishing, you will find an etiquette among anglers that sort of defines what you eat and what you throw back. It's based on conservation, how the fish fares as table fare and a general appreciation of where the fish ranks in the sporting category. Some people can be very passionate about catch and release. As this forum grows, the topic will be discussed endlessly. My feeling is ... keep what you want within the law. Anything you want to try on the skillet, that is a legal keeper, do it. You will find what you like to eat, but at the same time might develop a love or respect for certain fish and find that you always release them.

    Good choice on the DOAs. I love fishing them on 6 to 8 pound fluorocarbon on a light spinning rig.

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: FFF Staff] #588 09/18/07 12:00 PM
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    northBeachFish Offline OP
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    Thanks, JP. We may head down to Flamingo this weekend or next. I hear the fishing down there is amazing.


    First day fishing in Miami, five minutes after tossing a line in, bingo! Fourteen-inch permit. True beginner's luck.
    Re: Question from a noob [Re: FFF Staff] #590 09/18/07 03:25 PM
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    Capt. Jesse Karen Offline
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    Good stuff J.P. - Your ranking high in my book.

    As for Permit that are a top sportfish. They go back fer sure! Catching One on a shrimp is a feat!

    As for Snook and bait pods, they are very catchable. Especially if you catch the bait they are eating. They will seek out the injured one to eat. They are very lazy that way.

    As for loosing tackle.....well it's a necassary evil. Baracuda are the scourge of South Florida. If you rig with wire or heavy leader you will eliminate catching most other fish. So you just have to grin and bear it.

    Without a boat you won't catch hogfish or hog snapper...they are on the nearshore reefs. The mangrove snapper are easy to find and will eat shrimp like crazy.

    I fished the Oleta River for many years. It can be frustrating! Flamingo is not the same as years ago but it is perhaps the best all around fishery left in Florida.

    Without the help of a guide, it is very difficult to get dialed in, BUT if you are willing to learn and put your time in, you will catch fish.

    My neck of the Woods is problably closer to you then Mingo. Chokoloskee from Miami Beach is about 90 minutes give or take traffic. Flamingo is problably closer to two hours from the beach.

    You may want to start learning South Biscayne Bay. There are some great flats with Bones, Permit and Tarpon as well as Snapper and grouper at certain times of the year. There are snook in the creeks on the SW shoreline of the bay, but they are hard to catch in daylight!

    Launch at Homestead Bayfront Park and fish the flats on the west side of the Bay from the marina to well South of the Power Plant.

    Good luck and feel free to contact me anytime!


    Capt. Jesse Karen
    Fishing the 10,000 Islands in Naples, Marco Island and Everglades City!
    Families or professionals, I'll put you on the fish!

    http://www.madsnookin.com

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: Capt. Jesse Karen] #593 09/19/07 04:49 AM
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    northBeachFish Offline OP
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    Thanks to both of you.

    Friday we're headed up to that spot where me and my wife snorkeled in the school of bait fish -- the spot where the barracuda and lazy snook swim lay in the sand next to the school. We'll be fishing at night from the shore.

    We still have time to run the to the bait shop. Any suggestions?

    Also, do I need a special permit to fish for snook if I'm on the shore?


    Last edited by northBeachFish; 09/19/07 05:29 AM.

    First day fishing in Miami, five minutes after tossing a line in, bingo! Fourteen-inch permit. True beginner's luck.
    Re: Question from a noob [Re: northBeachFish] #594 09/19/07 06:22 AM
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    Keep in mind that snorkeling in a school of baitfish may put you in the food chain. When the fish and sharks get in to a frenzy and the water gets a little murky, sharks can make a mistake.

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: FFF Staff] #607 09/19/07 07:05 PM
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    Capt. Jesse Karen Offline
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    You need a Snook Stamp to kill a Snook....but it's best to let em' swim!

    Berkley Gulp 4" White Swimming Mullet on a red 1/4oz bare jig head.

    Slow bounce on the bottom almost a drag sometimes. Very effective at night!

    Theres a saying in the world of catching of Snook. "If it ain't white...it ain't right!"

    Good Luck and keep us updated!


    Capt. Jesse Karen
    Fishing the 10,000 Islands in Naples, Marco Island and Everglades City!
    Families or professionals, I'll put you on the fish!

    http://www.madsnookin.com

    Re: Question from a noob [Re: Capt. Jesse Karen] #610 09/20/07 05:10 AM
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    northBeachFish Offline OP
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    Okay, Capt. Jesse, I'll give that a try, likely later in the month. I don't if you have this problem, but in regards to my old lady, the fishing budget as reached a saturation point. However, she thinks she can out-fish me despite the fact that she has yet to hook anything except a tree limb since we started fishing down here three weeks ago. She did used to fish quite a bit fresh water with her dad back in the day so maybe she's not just talking smack.

    I'm hedging my bets that once she gets a couple fish on in the next week or two we'll sit down and reconfigure the budget so that's it's more fishing friendly I'm basing this the wry smile she flashed when the bait-and-tackle guy at the Sports Authority told her that the DOA Shrimp could be her "deadly secret weapon."

    In the mean time, I'm going try live shrimp hooked to an already purchased white bucktail jig and run it along the bottom as you suggested. Lisa, my wife, is fired up to run DOA shrimp. We'll see who the champ is.

    I'll tell you how it goes on Monday.

    Last edited by northBeachFish; 09/20/07 05:14 AM.

    First day fishing in Miami, five minutes after tossing a line in, bingo! Fourteen-inch permit. True beginner's luck.
    Re: Question from a noob [Re: northBeachFish] #619 09/22/07 07:20 PM
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    Capt. Jesse Karen Offline
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    good deal, good luck!


    Capt. Jesse Karen
    Fishing the 10,000 Islands in Naples, Marco Island and Everglades City!
    Families or professionals, I'll put you on the fish!

    http://www.madsnookin.com

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